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Author Topic: Zbrush - Workflow  (Read 51180 times)

Christian

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #30 on: January 10, 2014, 01:10:15 PM »
@wishgranter: Well - it's not The Q... it's me ;) - the only one I do not have to ask if I can publish...

I am based in Germany - exact address is

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Infinite

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #31 on: January 10, 2014, 03:53:53 PM »

Is somebody of you willing to upload models (full body scans) with the same stage of "no zBrushing"? I really would be interested in seeing other non-clear / non-makeup results.


You can purchase some RAW scans from triplegangers.com, some from 80x camera system some from 118x camera system. They can be useful to evaluate quality with and see camera placement.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2014, 03:58:54 PM by Infinite »
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Exhale

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #32 on: January 10, 2014, 09:49:44 PM »

Is somebody of you willing to upload models (full body scans) with the same stage of "no zBrushing"? I really would be interested in seeing other non-clear / non-makeup results.


You can purchase some RAW scans from triplegangers.com, some from 80x camera system some from 118x camera system. They can be useful to evaluate quality with and see camera placement.

It was on the top of my tongue Lee..   
Christian, just go for it,  resonable price indeed.


lecaramel

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #33 on: January 10, 2014, 11:49:11 PM »
Hi there!

I'm jumping in this topic a little bit late, but just to let you know that I'm working at Pixologic, makers of ZBrush, then I'll be glad to help if you have questions.

I just personally bought PhotoScan few hours ago, then of course, as soon as I'll be able to produce decent scans, I'll do my best to explain also how to simplify the workflow to clean/retouch your scans.

At least, just to simplify this workflow:

Try this:
(...)
4. Click on a ZSphere
5. Choose the uncloned high-detailed PS-mesh for "Rigging"
6. Choose the ZRemeshed low-poly mesh as a topology (and you have to move one vertex in order that ZBrush will work correctly - sometimes you have to tweak it imho)
7. Turn on "Projection" (and sometimes you have to tweak the default settings)
8. Preview an "Adaptive Skin" by choosing the desired density for the object (mostly 3-6)
9. "Make Adaptive Skin"
(...)

You don't need to use ZSpheres to do that.
Simply subdivide several time your new ZRemeshed model to have at least the same number of polygons than your original scan (to avoid losing information), then in Tool >> SubTool >> Project, press the Project All function: the visible SubTool (the scan), will be projected on the ZRemeshed one.

The good thing about this solution is that you can also mask some areas to protect from the projection, using the morph targets to protect an area, why not projecting on layers, etc.

Anyway, just ask for help!

Thomas

bmc130

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #34 on: January 13, 2014, 10:17:20 AM »
lecaramel, do you know if pixologic will add paint on texture support in zbrush so you can paint on a lowpoly mesh using it's UV as a base, the same way as Mari or Mudbox? Or do you know a way of doing it in zbrush today without painting on vertex color?

tezen

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #35 on: January 13, 2014, 02:06:12 PM »
Hello Lecaramel!
Yes - you don?t need a ZSphere but you have full control about the topology within a ZSphere.
One wish: A GoZ-Plugin for PhotoScan would be very VERY nice and a good improvement to the workflow!
...and one question: Is Pixologic working on a -much faster- 64bit-Version of ZBrush???
Greetz tezen

Infinite

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #36 on: January 13, 2014, 02:30:12 PM »
Hello Lecaramel!
Yes - you don?t need a ZSphere but you have full control about the topology within a ZSphere.
One wish: A GoZ-Plugin for PhotoScan would be very VERY nice and a good improvement to the workflow!
...and one question: Is Pixologic working on a -much faster- 64bit-Version of ZBrush???
Greetz tezen

Agreed on 64bit, it would help overcome crashing when exporting directly anything over 7,000,000 as .OBJ. ZBrush just wasn't designed to handle those file sizes back in 2000.

GoZ can over come this to say Modo which is OK but not ideal. Now GoZ to Photoscan! That would be incredible for sure, as well as Mudbox.
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Lily

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #37 on: February 12, 2014, 11:10:45 AM »
Hello Mfranquelo!

Try this:
1. Load the PS-mesh into ZBrush
2. Clone it (and decimate the clone down to ~100000 polys for much faster ZRemeshing!)
3. ZRemesh that clone with a maximum of 15000 polys (because of the next step:)
4. Click on a ZSphere
5. Choose the uncloned high-detailed PS-mesh for "Rigging"
6. Choose the ZRemeshed low-poly mesh as a topology (and you have to move one vertex in order that ZBrush will work correctly - sometimes you have to tweak it imho)
7. Turn on "Projection" (and sometimes you have to tweak the default settings)
8. Preview an "Adaptive Skin" by choosing the desired density for the object (mostly 3-6)
9. "Make Adaptive Skin"
10. Use "UV Master" to create a perfect UV (on the lowest SDiv-level)
11. "Copy" that UV and "Paste" it to the highly-detailed adaptive skin
12. Export this UV-mapped 3D-object as .obj in the highest settings SDiv-level (On objects with more multi-million polys it is good to decimate that before; dont forget to turn on "Keep UVs" in "Decimation Master")
13. Load the exported 3D-object into the original PS-chunk
14. "Build Texture"
15. Ready!

There are still some other ways to do the same thing...

Greetz
tezen

When a finished model is imported into Geomagic, the UV seams on it is quite apparent [ in 3dmax will see nothing]. How to clear them away? Do I miss any point?

Wishgranter

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #38 on: February 12, 2014, 11:40:59 AM »
what need to do in Geomagic ? hollowing the model ?

The seams are because how Geomagic work with textures, on the resulting model it will be OK....
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lecaramel

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #39 on: February 17, 2014, 08:07:20 PM »
Sorry for the long delay of my answer, didn't have an email notification...

I'm sorry, but we are never commenting/speaking about future features of ZBrush until they are announced... But i can speak about the 64 bits since it has laready been announced for ZBrush 5.

About GoZ for PhotoScan, in fact, it's more up to Agisoft to do the integration. I can contact them directly. But for sure, it could improve the workflow :)

@infinite: ZBrush is crashing when importing scans with more than 7 millions of polys? Or when manipulating these 7 millions after importing?
You can contact me by email if you want: thomas at pixologic dot com, eventually with your workflow. Also having some of your large scans may be helpfull for us to test (note, I bought a couple of your raw files at triplegangers to do test too..)

@bmc130 : yes you can paint on texture directly with the help of ZappLink and Photoshop by projection, but not a "real" paint on texture like you are doing on some other software.

Infinite

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #40 on: February 17, 2014, 08:20:10 PM »
Sorry for the long delay of my answer, didn't have an email notification...

I'm sorry, but we are never commenting/speaking about future features of ZBrush until they are announced... But i can speak about the 64 bits since it has laready been announced for ZBrush 5.

Cannot wait for 64bit and being able to sculpt over 10 million polygons reliably, as well as be able to support larger than 8k textures :)

About GoZ for PhotoScan, in fact, it's more up to Agisoft to do the integration. I can contact them directly. But for sure, it could improve the workflow :)

This would be very powerful.

@infinite: ZBrush is crashing when importing scans with more than 7 millions of polys? Or when manipulating these 7 millions after importing?
You can contact me by email if you want: thomas at pixologic dot com, eventually with your workflow. Also having some of your large scans may be helpfull for us to test (note, I bought a couple of your raw files at triplegangers to do test too..)

ZBrush crashes when exporting more than 7 million polygons as .OBJ. Paul Gaboury mentioned this could be a legacy issue because ZB was never built to handle these types of sizes.. It's possible to use Goz to Modo but not ideal.

I would be happy to share any data with Pixologic. I also have a bunch of ideas that could be useful for ZBrush 5 to help the industry that deal with scanned data. Zbrush hasn't had much love with regards to supporting the growing scanning industry and we could do with some :)

Things like intelligent hole fill, multi camera import, paint layers. FYI im on the ZBrush beta but have never heard anything since I signed the papers back in 2011!!

@bmc130 : yes you can paint on texture directly with the help of ZappLink and Photoshop by projection, but not a "real" paint on texture like you are doing on some other software.

Sadly there are many bugs with this method, going back and forth to PS, projection errors, seams, back side projection etc Also the lack of paint layers is a huge missing link.

But without ZBrush it would be near impossible to work with RAW photogrammetry data from Agisoft Photoscan. It's an essential part of the pipeline and incredible at that.
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lecaramel

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #41 on: February 18, 2014, 04:52:32 PM »
Cannot wait for 64bit and being able to sculpt over 10 million polygons reliably, as well as be able to support larger than 8k textures :)
The problem is that their is a difference between sculpting (brush strokes) and several operations, like Projections. Projection can need 4 times more memory than usual operations, then yes, if ZBrush is at its limit with the mesh itself, things can become problematic :)

Quote
ZBrush crashes when exporting more than 7 million polygons as .OBJ. Paul Gaboury mentioned this could be a legacy issue because ZB was never built to handle these types of sizes.. It's possible to use Goz to Modo but not ideal.
A trick is to try exporting through 3D Print Exporter or through Decimation Master (you have export options in these plugins), which are using a specific exporter, not the ZBrush native one).

Quote
I would be happy to share any data with Pixologic. I also have a bunch of ideas that could be useful for ZBrush 5 to help the industry that deal with scanned data. Zbrush hasn't had much love with regards to supporting the growing scanning industry and we could do with some :)

Things like intelligent hole fill, multi camera import, paint layers. FYI im on the ZBrush beta but have never heard anything since I signed the papers back in 2011!!
Well, all your ideas are more than welcome. We are now two team members at Pixologic using PhotoScan and working with scan datas and facing real issues ourselves is also the best thing to understand your problems.. and as you can imagine, it's not the same as having a "bug report" :)


@bmc130 : yes you can paint on texture directly with the help of ZappLink and Photoshop by projection, but not a "real" paint on texture like you are doing on some other software.

Quote
Sadly there are many bugs with this method, going back and forth to PS, projection errors, seams, back side projection etc Also the lack of paint layers is a huge missing link.
Yes, I can understand, in a way, I was just answer on the question on a technical point of view.

Quote
But without ZBrush it would be near impossible to work with RAW photogrammetry data from Agisoft Photoscan. It's an essential part of the pipeline and incredible at that.
And that's why all feedback is more than welcome.

At which email can I contact you / chat with you?
Also, I'm doing an online webinar in France tomorrow about ZBrush and scan datas. If you have extra samples or raw images, I'll be glad to show them, including what can be wrong in shooting, even with your fantastic setup! :)

Infinite

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #42 on: February 18, 2014, 06:06:38 PM »
Cannot wait for 64bit and being able to sculpt over 10 million polygons reliably, as well as be able to support larger than 8k textures :)
The problem is that their is a difference between sculpting (brush strokes) and several operations, like Projections. Projection can need 4 times more memory than usual operations, then yes, if ZBrush is at its limit with the mesh itself, things can become problematic :)

Quote
ZBrush crashes when exporting more than 7 million polygons as .OBJ. Paul Gaboury mentioned this could be a legacy issue because ZB was never built to handle these types of sizes.. It's possible to use Goz to Modo but not ideal.
A trick is to try exporting through 3D Print Exporter or through Decimation Master (you have export options in these plugins), which are using a specific exporter, not the ZBrush native one).

Quote
I would be happy to share any data with Pixologic. I also have a bunch of ideas that could be useful for ZBrush 5 to help the industry that deal with scanned data. Zbrush hasn't had much love with regards to supporting the growing scanning industry and we could do with some :)

Things like intelligent hole fill, multi camera import, paint layers. FYI im on the ZBrush beta but have never heard anything since I signed the papers back in 2011!!
Well, all your ideas are more than welcome. We are now two team members at Pixologic using PhotoScan and working with scan datas and facing real issues ourselves is also the best thing to understand your problems.. and as you can imagine, it's not the same as having a "bug report" :)


@bmc130 : yes you can paint on texture directly with the help of ZappLink and Photoshop by projection, but not a "real" paint on texture like you are doing on some other software.

Quote
Sadly there are many bugs with this method, going back and forth to PS, projection errors, seams, back side projection etc Also the lack of paint layers is a huge missing link.
Yes, I can understand, in a way, I was just answer on the question on a technical point of view.

Quote
But without ZBrush it would be near impossible to work with RAW photogrammetry data from Agisoft Photoscan. It's an essential part of the pipeline and incredible at that.
And that's why all feedback is more than welcome.

At which email can I contact you / chat with you?
Also, I'm doing an online webinar in France tomorrow about ZBrush and scan datas. If you have extra samples or raw images, I'll be glad to show them, including what can be wrong in shooting, even with your fantastic setup! :)

Thanks for the feedback.

You can reach me on admin " at " ir-ltd.net interested to talk further with you :)
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bmc130

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #43 on: February 18, 2014, 11:07:23 PM »
I want to see the online webinar :) Is it open for public?

Wishgranter

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Re: Zbrush - Workflow
« Reply #44 on: February 18, 2014, 11:38:40 PM »
Webinar for freee :-D 
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