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Author Topic: Point clouds in Autocad 2016  (Read 15983 times)

nadar

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Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« on: November 01, 2015, 01:34:54 PM »
I'm always looking for an efficient solution to draw and measure architectural features (windows, doors, etc.) from point clouds of buildings, obtained either with an UAV or with a pole.
I tried automatic feature recognition (e.g. PointFuse), but as the cloud is noisy, the extracted features are not accurate enough and/or splitted in too many faces.
I thing manual extraction will better suit my needs: I want to draw the architectural features directly on the cloud to obtain topologically "clean" polygons such as rectangles, volumes, etc.

The latest version of Autocad 2016 and Civil3D 2016 have very intersting functionalties to manage point clouds in such a way:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCR95F0Fo88

The general workflow is to prepare the original cloud (I'm usually working with .LAS files) in an external application, Recap. It will organise different files to merge these in a .RCP file that can be attached to an Autocad drawing. According to the demo, during this preparation phase, the software will "structure" the cloud, i.e. recognise planes in the structure of the cloud. Recap has a very simple interface, and the parameters for this segmentation does'nt  seem to be accessible to the user.

When the cloud is attached to an Autocad (or Civil3D) drawing, I can acess most functionalities such as slicing, automatic recpgnition of features in slices, etc. Snapping on cloud points works well.
Unfortunately, the possibility to modify the local coordinate system ("Dynamic UCS") by snapping on planes identified in the "structured" cloud doesn't work with me. Apparently, no structure was detected during Recap preparation.
I tried with many different Photoscan-generated clouds, and even with "pure" Lidar samples, but the result is always the same.
This functionality of Dynamic UCS would be very useful.
Does anybody already tried this ?  Is it a problem with the nature of the data generated by Photoscan ? I'm using .LAS. Will another format be more adequate ? Do I have to clean or reorganise the data in another software ?
Is the problem related to some settings in Autocad ?
Any suggestion will be more than welcome, because I'm sure this possibility to combine large point clouds with a 3D Cad software used widely by architects will be a great asset.


According to the demo, the

chrisd

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2015, 04:05:44 PM »
I have used ReCap, and the only way to align the coordinate system by using the "Ultimate" version and use the following method:
https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/recap-pro/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/ENU/Reality-Capture/files/GUID-E6857374-B19B-4689-9A34-BC2DA7E73F8C-htm.html

The ability to use Survey Markers is not supported by other versions of ReCap. Autodesk has changed the ReCap website, there was a comparison between the versions but I can't find it anymore. It did show that Ultimate is the only version that can use survey markers.


chrisd

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2015, 04:18:25 PM »
After rereading your post, ReCap may not be the solution you are looking for. The registration function does not actually produce the planes, like in feature extraction.

Dieter

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2015, 08:08:12 PM »
@nadar


I think it is a software Problem, because it dont work for me with laserscan data too in Acad 2016. The only thing what is working is the catching of a point in a pointcloud.

I will ask tomorrow my AutoCAD-hotline.

nadar

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2015, 11:38:38 AM »
@nadar


I think it is a software Problem, because it dont work for me with laserscan data too in Acad 2016. The only thing what is working is the catching of a point in a pointcloud.

I will ask tomorrow my AutoCAD-hotline.

I was alos thinking about a software problem. I've read in a forum that it worked in 2015 version but no more in 2016.
I've tried the old version, but also with no success.

For me too, snapping to a point in the cloud works fine, but when I see the deme, having dynamic UCS would be really more efficient...
For the moment, I draw a planar triangle by snapping on 3 points on a wall, and use this polygon as a reference to create a local UCS. Not as straightforward as it could be....


nadar

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2015, 11:46:55 AM »
I have used ReCap, and the only way to align the coordinate system by using the "Ultimate" version and use the following method:

I think the method you describe here is to define the global reference system of the project ("WCS"). I'm looking for a solution to locally modify the local coordinate system ("UCS") to properly align current drawings. For instance define a UCS on a wall before to draw all windows on that wall, then another UCS on a roof plane, etc...
I do the global referecing within   Photoscan,  and as far as I can see, the imported cloud is perfectly referenced

Dieter

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2015, 01:52:55 PM »
There are two solutions:

1) Laserscandata:

Export the data from your software to a PTX or PTG-File. Then import the data in Recap, make a RCP-File and Import it in Acad.
That is the normal workflow for a Leica Scanner.

2) Agisoftdata

Agisoft canĀ“t export in a PTX or PTG-file. But there is a Workaround ;)

Export the data in a XYZ-ASCII File from photocad. Then import the xyz-File in Recap. Then export a single RCS-file out of Recap and import it in Acad. Therefore in the export-Settings in recap you have to set the raster to the minimum.

These are the two ways for me and my data and it works perfect.

nadar

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2015, 04:28:46 PM »
Hello Dieter
Thank you for your help.

I tried the workflow you suggested (Agisoft version)
I exported the data from Photosca, as .TXT file and imported it in Recap. Everything OK
I cant't find an option to define "raster to the minimum" and the only option I have for saving the file is .RCP. No "single .RCS" available

When I attach the resulting file to Acad, same results than previously: I can snap on individual points in the cloud, but not on planes supposedly recognised by Recap. As a consequence, dynamic UCS doesn't work as well

Dieter

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2015, 06:03:39 PM »
In the upper line is the import ribbon. Move the Cursor over the Import ribbon, then the Export ribbon appears under the Import ribbon.

Or use strg-E.

Then type in a name for the data, use rcs-File and then there is a ribbon for Options. There you move the statusbar to the left side, for a Minimum edges.

I would send you a screenshot, but i have the geman Version......


nadar

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2015, 07:33:02 PM »
OK, I've found it.
BUT.... i tried on several models, and the progress bar of the export to .RCS always stops after 9%, but no file is written....

Dieter

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2015, 08:46:13 PM »
I can try it for you, send me a link to download the data, then i will try it.....

nadar

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2015, 12:58:06 AM »
Hello Dieter

Following your indications, I was able to get some planes in the .RCS file, but these planes are placed incorectly (see attachment)

Thanks for the proposal to test my file.
The .LAS is quite large. Please send me an email adress and I will send you the file via WeTransfer
My adress is xxxxx

« Last Edit: November 03, 2015, 12:13:41 PM by nadar »

Dieter

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2015, 03:37:04 PM »
My result is the same as yours. Recap finds not enough planes.

Maybe it's the noisy point clouds from pictures. There is no adjustment in Recap, which affect the segmentation.

 :(

nadar

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2015, 07:41:24 PM »
Thanks a lot for your help, Dieter

At least this confirms there is nothing wrong on my side.
Any idea about how to reduce the noise in my model ?
I'm using Meshlab and Cloudcompare. Both seem to have some cleaning tools, but I cant find the most appropriate one

Dieter

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Re: Point clouds in Autocad 2016
« Reply #14 on: November 04, 2015, 10:44:00 AM »
I will do a few test, because i need the 3dOsnap in acad too with my pointclouds out of photos.

I think it is a combination from noisy point cloud and fileformat.

I will try to Export my laserscandata in ASCII-Format and Segmentation with recap and then verify the Results.

I post the results here later........