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Author Topic: Rolling shutter option detail  (Read 20966 times)

Phogi

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Rolling shutter option detail
« on: September 04, 2017, 08:15:33 AM »
Hi Alexey,

Thanks for the rolling shutter option in camera optimising, in some of my datasets it shows smaller RMS for cameras if chosen. However, I found it is also leading smaller RMS for P4p photos, does it look right? Is there any detail of when it should be used in the website of the rolling shutter option?

Thanks a lot!

Cheers,

SAV

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #1 on: September 04, 2017, 09:02:39 AM »
Hi Phogi,

The DJI Phantom 4 Pro (P4P) uses a mechanical shutter to capture photographs, hence there should not be any rolling shutter issue. However, if you are using frames extracted from a video file that has been acquired with your P4P, you will notice the rolling shutter problem because for video the camera uses an electronic shutter.

I hope that helps.

Regards,
SAV

Jeremiah_ROWE

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2017, 04:02:56 PM »
Double check to make sure you are using the mechanical shutter. There is an option to disable it and use only electronic.

Phogi

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2017, 07:22:40 AM »
Thank you gentlemen, what I found is the function of the "rolling shutter" option will impact on the camera model of the P4p data, and the RMS reported in cameras is smaller sometimes. I would like to know if this function is actually working for both camera settings?

Yoann Courtois

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2017, 05:38:02 PM »
Hi everyone !

From my experience I would say the P4P has :
- An electronic global shutter when capturing pictures
- An electronic rolling shutter when capturing movies

As well, to my mind and for the moment, rolling shutter adjustment is a piece of hell !
Indeed, a short time ago one of my colleagues used rolling shutter adjustment on a project. The direct given results looked pretty good, really small RMS and so. But actually the focal length dropped and the vertical precision was completely bad (misfortune this time GCPs were set almost on an unique plan). Rolling shutter adjustment distorted pictures by strips and if you don't have a perfect set up, you cannot assure any accuracy.

So Phogi, in a word, I suggest you not to use that adjustment, especially for P4P pictures because there is actually no jello effect.

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Yoann COURTOIS
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Jeremiah_ROWE

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2017, 07:17:49 PM »
The photo mode on the P4 Pro gives you a choice of either

A) mechanical shutter (physical leaf-type, not electronic)

or

B) a purely electronic shutter mode type


Yoann Courtois

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2017, 07:57:29 PM »
The photo mode on the P4 Pro gives you a choice of either

A) mechanical shutter (physical leaf-type, not electronic)

or

B) a purely electronic shutter mode type

Really ? How can we set it up ?
Maybe it's an obvious question, but I'm not pilot for now and hadn't spent a lot of time on our drone.
I was focusing on data processing and will train myself as a pilot soon.

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SAV

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2017, 07:09:00 AM »
Hi Yoann,

It is an option in the DJI GO 4 app (see attached image).
Note that in video mode the DJI P4P will always use the electronic shutter.

Image courtesy of JAFARANI. See his original post here: https://forum.dji.com/thread-78616-1-1.html

Regards,
SAV

Yoann Courtois

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2017, 09:55:08 AM »
Thanks for this detailed answer !

Since, I've red somewhere that mechanical/electronic shutter doesn't mean global/rolling shutter.
So we could have a rolling mechanical shutter (?) or a global electronic shutter (which is actually exist)

May you confirm that point ?

Regards
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Yoann COURTOIS
R&D Engineer in photogrammetric process and mobile application
Lyon, FRANCE
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SAV

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2017, 10:44:15 AM »
Hi Yoann,

There are basically 3 types of shutters used in cameras:
 
1. Mechanical shutter
2. Electronic shutter
3. Hybrid shutter (mixture of 1 and 2)

When it comes to electronic shutters, you can either have a rolling electronic shutter or a global electronic shutter (= total electronic shutter). Most digital cameras use a rolling electronic shutter, which leads to the rolling shutter issue we try to avoid for photogrammetric processing.

Note that some cameras use an electronic shutter for live view (& video) and a mechanical shutter for still photographs (e.g., the camera used on the DJI Phantom 4 Pro).

I am not aware of a 'rolling mechanical shutter' issue because the information from the sensor is not read line by line but in one go, hence no rolling shutter issues.

If your camera is moving during photo acquisition (e.g., camera is mounted on drone/UAV), you have basically four options to mitigate the rolling shutter problem:
1. Use a camera with a mechanical shutter
2. Use a camera with a (hard) global shutter
3. Compensate for the rolling shutter effect in post processing (as it can be done in Pix4D and Agisoft PhotoScan)
4. Change your 'survey design' (i.e., stop for each image) and adjust the camera settings (i.e., higher shutter speed)

Regards,
SAV

Thanks for this detailed answer !

Since, I've red somewhere that mechanical/electronic shutter doesn't mean global/rolling shutter.
So we could have a rolling mechanical shutter (?) or a global electronic shutter (which is actually exist)

May you confirm that point ?

Regards
« Last Edit: September 14, 2017, 10:47:52 AM by SAV »

Yoann Courtois

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2017, 10:58:41 AM »
That's confirm most of what I red here and there. Thanks a lot !

Final oral exam next week... and sometimes at the very last moment some critical points should be confirm to avoid obvious mistakes when under pressure  ;D

Regards
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Yoann COURTOIS
R&D Engineer in photogrammetric process and mobile application
Lyon, FRANCE
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SAV

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2017, 11:05:03 AM »
Always better to get rid of any doubt/confusion  ;)

Good luck for your oral exam next week.

Regards,
SAV

Yoann Courtois

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #12 on: September 25, 2017, 10:13:56 AM »
Hi SAV !

Thanks for the support ! I'm now graduated  :D
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Yoann COURTOIS
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SAV

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #13 on: September 25, 2017, 12:24:08 PM »
Congrats. Well done.

Is your thesis available for download?

Regards,
SAV

Yoann Courtois

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Re: Rolling shutter option detail
« Reply #14 on: September 25, 2017, 01:05:25 PM »
Thank you !

No sorry it is confidential for the next 2 years ! and note that everything is in French...

Regards
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Yoann COURTOIS
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Lyon, FRANCE
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